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  1. #1751
    Regular Neil Mac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darren Langeveld View Post
    Maybe lots of people just want to back it/him?

    Listen to you all! Conspiracy theories from the get go!

    You need to step outside your echo chambers and listen to something else. Like you should have done in the run up to the referendum - maybe then the result wouldn’t have been such a shock to you.
    Who needs conspiracy theories when the Electoral Commission have previously busted the same people for breaking Electoral financing laws? Instead of aiming to be more accountable and transparent this time around, they've taken actions to conceal the sources of their funding.

    I think lots of people do want to support Monsieur Farage. However, I don't think they're the ones who have bunged him £750k of untraceable money.
    Last edited by Neil Mac; 16-04-2019 at 07:37 AM.
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  2. #1752
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neil Mac View Post
    Who needs conspiracy theories when the Electoral Commission have previously busted the same people for breaking Electoral financing laws?
    Remain were also fined for exactly that.

    Everyone's at it. Not that it excuses Farage or anyone else, it just reflects how dirty both sides have been, and will probably continue to be.

  3. #1753
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    Quote Originally Posted by jacobyte View Post
    Everyone's at it. Not that it excuses Farage or anyone else, it just reflects how dirty both sides have been, and will probably continue to be.
    All the more reason why a second public vote isn't wise. Some people are prepared to throw a lot of money around to try to sway the public vote in a direction which favours only them, and will lie and cheat to do so. Add to that outside interference from countries who benefit from the chaos, and it all adds up to a bad time.

    We really need our politicians to step up and take responsibility to agree on a way forward with the best interests of the country as a whole at heart.
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  4. #1754
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neil Mac View Post
    We really need our politicians to step up and take responsibility to agree on a way forward with the best interests of the country as a whole at heart.

    We should encourage those that don't want to be politicians to be politicians, and forbid those that want to be politicians from being politicians. A bit like in Gladiator.
    Last edited by jacobyte; 16-04-2019 at 08:54 AM.

  5. #1755
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    Quote Originally Posted by jacobyte View Post

    We should encourage those that don't want to be politicians to be politicians, and forbid those that want to be politicians from being politicians. A bit like in Gladiator.
    Exactly
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  6. #1756
    Quote Originally Posted by Neil Mac View Post
    Have you seen Farage's new party fund-raising scam? He claims they've already raised over £750k in individual sub-£500 donations. The £500 bit is important, as above that more detailed records are required. All this money has arrived via Paypal, which anonymises the source of the cash. The authorities can demand the detail, but the Brexit Party's server is conveniently located outside of UK legal jurisdiction. So, it's entirely possible that one or two large organisations or individuals are throwing large numbers of £499 donations as part of a big money-laundering scheme. Perfect.

    I think it's outrageous to suggest that an honest and decent former city banker should be involved in any kind of rule bending....

  7. #1757
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neil Mac View Post
    All the more reason why a second public vote isn't wise. Some people are prepared to throw a lot of money around to try to sway the public vote in a direction which favours only them, and will lie and cheat to do so. Add to that outside interference from countries who benefit from the chaos, and it all adds up to a bad time.

    We really need our politicians to step up and take responsibility to agree on a way forward with the best interests of the country as a whole at heart.
    If people weren't so easily conned, it wouldn't be an issue
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  8. #1758
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    Quote Originally Posted by dex View Post
    I think it's outrageous to suggest that an honest and decent former city banker should be involved in any kind of rule bending....
    There are never any honest and decent people around when you need them.
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  9. #1759
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    Quote Originally Posted by jacobyte View Post
    Remain were also fined for exactly that.
    No, they weren't. The scale is hugely different.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-44080096

    Trying to make out that 'they're all the same' when there is such a huge weight of evidence against the Leave campaign is one of the most worrying aspects of the whole thing.

    One was using huge sums of money from outside the country, to run massive social media campaigns, based on lies.

    The other lost a few receipts.

    Those two aren't the same.
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  10. #1760
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  11. #1761
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    I was saying its gone very quiet of late over Brexit
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  12. #1762
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    Having failed to compromise in any way in public for months, there's now failure to compromise going on behind closed doors, with Labour, too.


    There are probably record-setting quantities of red lines being pointlessly reinforced going on as we type, with record amounts of nothing to show out of the back of it.
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  13. #1763
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    Itís all going so well, isnít it . Twats, the lot of them.
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  14. #1764
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    I see our hapless PM has been informed of her departure

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48290760
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  15. #1765
    Hmmm, interesting developments this morning... yet unsurprising.
    Uncertain and unstable times ahead for all concerned.

  16. #1766
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    Ian Dunt described the lectern outside of No.10 as 'the lectern of infinite crisis'

    I think that's about right.

    Her speech had the tone of a petulant child not getting what it wanted in a toyshop.

    Whilst her departure was probably the only way out of the tragic Tory deadlock over this, the prospects for her replacement are properly terrifying, especially if they have The Fear on them over whatever the Brexit Party Ltd results are on Sunday.

    None of this is a good look.
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  17. #1767
    So once we've wasted a bit more time with a Tory leadership contest I guess the only thing left is a General Election before we run out of ways for the Government to kick the can down the road and accept that they've committed to delivering the undeliverable...


    I'm waiting with interest to see which MP wants to sacrifice their career as the driver of the world's longest slow motion train crash.

  18. #1768
    My guess is a pro brexit PM, can kicked down the road, unworkable deal proposed (marry new girlfriend but shag the ex wife and her sister type deal) , EU gets pissed off and kicks us out by not extending
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  19. #1769
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    BoJo is the overwhelming favourite and has already said we will leave by 31 Oct even if it means No Deal.

    Didn't May say similar about 29 Mar?
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    Itís Theresaís choreographer I feel sorry for.
    Takes a lot of skill to look this bad you know...

  21. #1771
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    We have a brextremist MP.

    He likes to 'help out' behind the bar at the Kashmir stage at the Isle of Wight Festival. Kashmir runs independently within IW Festival and raises money for the local Quay Arts Centre.

    My mate Doug runs the Kashmir stage.

    Doug asked for a reel of B*llocks to Brexit stickers for the staff, for Kashmir. I helped out.

    I had forgotten that Sideshow Bob likes to help out at Kashmir. I don't think Doug had forgotten about that.

    https://iwradio.co.uk/2019/06/18/ord...kashmir-pints/

    He would have been surrounded by staff, uniformly wearing the stickers.

    Sometimes it's the small things.
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  22. #1772
    Quote Originally Posted by Diamond Hell View Post
    We have a brextremist MP.
    We will shortly have a brextremist PM

    Someone who has such a casual relationship with the truth that Trump is a fervent admirer

    When he lied in his £5k per week Telegraph column, claiming a no-deal Brexit was ďby some marginĒ the British publicís preferred outcome, the press regulator ruled against him

    The Telegraphís actual defense for running this nonsense was that Johnsonís column ďcould not be reasonably read as a serious, empirical, in-depth analysis of hard factual matters.Ē

    More recently his building model buses bullshit was a brilliant cynical ploy to ensure that whenever anyone searches for "Boris Bus", now the results are simply everyone everywhere making fun of his "hobby"

    The week before the results were a £350M Red Bus

    Make the lie disappear by talking bollocks

  23. #1773
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    Anyone see Anne Widecombe recently-better than her performances on ‘Strictly Come Dancing’ I thought.

    https://youtu.be/HOwRhkWpnuI

    We’ve had the much heralded second referendum in the form of the recent EU elections where overall leave party’s received the most votes. The Brexit party has the biggest party in the place.
    Even when researching the above link & giving my sore body a rest I’ve let play some mep’s introduction at Brussels where there’s a lot of criticism of how they handed out their jobs last week as well as ‘lets get on with it’.

    & this leak last night about Trump well that’s just a opportunity for Jeremy Hunt to appear all statesmanlike to poo poo it. That’s what the cynic in me thinks. Makes a change from Boris bashing at every opportunity.

    Murky times ahead sadly.
    Last edited by Fitz711; 08-07-2019 at 10:08 AM.

  24. #1774
    Quote Originally Posted by Fitz711 View Post
    & this leak last night about Trump well thatís just a opportunity for Jeremy Hunt to appear all statesmanlike to poo poo it. Thatís what the cynic in me thinks. Makes a change from Boris bashing at every opportunity.

    Murky times ahead sadly.
    Murky indeed, this is what many commentators are suggesting:

    "Itís hard to see the leak as anything other than an aggressive power play by an unknown party ahead of the arrival of Boris Johnson in No. 10 later this month. Darrochís posting in Washington was due to come to an end in January, with Sedwill among those tipped to replace him in the plum role unless ó as had been rumored ó Darroch is asked to stay on until after next yearís election. Both men are reviled as arch-europhiles by ardent Brexiteers, and the suspicion must be this leak was designed to ensure Darroch is replaced with a more Brexit-friendly, Trumpian figure. Itís worth noting that plenty of Boris supporters have no time for Sedwill either and would also like to see a very different figure sitting at the new PMís side." - Jack Blanchard - Politico

    ďA theory among British officials in the United States is that the leak had less to do with Mr. Darroch than with his successor. The leak, according to this theory, may have been intended to assure that Mr. Sedwill was not appointed, and that a more pro-Trump, pro-Brexit diplomat would be sent to fill Britainís most prestigious ambassadorial post.Ē - Ellen Barry - New York Times

  25. #1775
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    It's incredibly ugly and dirty and unpleasant.

    If Labour comes out as an actual opposition to Brexit, then Brexit support definitely does not have a majority.

    As it is a no deal Brexit got about 13% public support, which looks incredibly weak after three years of debunking of the lies used to promote Brexit:

    https://fullfact.org/europe/did-one-...o-deal-brexit/

    As the deadlock in parliament is currently unchanged, this is all pretty academic anyway.

    The only certain thing is that this autumn is going to be a bumpy political ride for the tenuously clinging together United Kingdom.
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  26. #1776
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    Thom-you can’t take a vote for European elections them use it to come up with an answer to a question that hasn’t been asked.
    It’s like this Snp nonsense where they say Scotland voted remain but again that’s an inference heavily weighted by using the results to a different question then framing it to one that had not been asked.

    Actually come to think about it I might contact them & ask for them to vote representatively at 60:40 or whatever it was as a fair representation. That might almost be enough to get the deal over the line.

  27. #1777
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fitz711 View Post
    Thom-you canít take a vote for European elections them use it to come up with an answer to a question that hasnít been asked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Fitz711 View Post
    Weíve had the much heralded second referendum in the form of the recent EU elections
    erm...
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  28. #1778
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neil Mac View Post
    erm...
    People can change their mind! Or word things differently. Or whatever lame parallel Iím trying to draw with politiciansí and partiesí Brexit stance.

    Iím ever the optimist here. My prediction for the future:

    Is Boris any more likely get through his deal or no deal than May? Nope. Do I really think heíll let a no-deal Brexit happen? Nope. He has an eye on a relatively imminent general election and wonít want to risk choppy waters between exit and then. Will he risk a pre-Brexit GE? He might. It is probably madness, but he might. He does, however, have a reputation for not entering fights that he canít win. A pre-Brexit GE win would probably give him a mandate to take us out and enough time to stabilise our free fall and white-wash the tough times. However, that is the nuclear option for him tbh as I donít think he can win that snap GE.

    Labour look spooked by recent polling and I think a populist leader like Boris will scare them. I suspect Borisí arrival will trigger a full declaration of Brexit support by the Labour Party. It is save your skins and stop the Tories time, and I think Corbyn will bow to party pressure, swallow Brexit and try to carry favour with the nation. Such a move only pushes us further away from a deal going through as the Corbynistas will take his lead and only strengthen the parliamentary opposition to a poor-deal Brexit.

    We will reach the natural time for a GE and get a hung parliament, Tories will win the GE, but be unable to form their own coalition. A coalition will be formed by the other parties on a no Brexit ticket. Parliament will kill Brexit, survive 18 months and then call another GE. In the meantime the Tories absolutely implode.
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  29. #1779
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    Quote Originally Posted by simonsaunders View Post
    In the meantime the Tories absolutely implode.
    We can but hope.
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  30. #1780
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neil Mac View Post
    erm...
    Don't go pointing out the holes in the rules he makes for himself, it'll only make this so awkward.

    Ian, we know you got the marginal result you want (I honestly have no idea why you want it), but as someone living in a democratic society, you have to accept it's OK to see if people's minds have changed three + years on, when so many lies have been blown up.

    If - as you're suggesting - there's a majority for Brexit, then you have nothing to worry about, so I don't quite understand why this is such a difficult thing to do.

    Why do you want to Brexit, anyway? Is it just to get Scottish independence, so you remain in the EU?
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  31. #1781
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    Fantastic - I’ve lit this up again.
    Actually Neil I’m glad you’ve popped up as (& it may be me) but I was just thinking yesterday I hadn’t noticed you recently as there was a rav4 on a hubnut video I was watching.

    DH - I keep saying this but ‘try & play the ball & not the man’.
    It’s a consistent (like Scotland voting to leave suggestion when the question wasn’t asked & was a ‘marginal’ preference.) but part of the fun in discussing this is to keep to a certain class.
    I watched with interest but the 2nd referendum we had on this didn’t bring a marked change in attitude that remain keep procrastinating about. Actually it delivered a very clear message in my interpretation of it all.
    However your position is clear-you’re in the measured minority.

    I’m off to weld a mk1 Escort. How very British x.

  32. #1782
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    Hi Iain, been busy recently. Pop in more frequently to read than write.

    Do you think all the Brexiteers voted for people who want nothing to do with the EU to go and 'work' in the EU parliament? Sounds bonkers to me... 37% turnout indicates otherwise, wouldn't you say?
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  33. #1783
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fitz711 View Post
    Actually it delivered a very clear message in my interpretation of it all.

    None as blind as choose not to see, eh? I've seen your interpretation of how to behave on a track day, so it's OK - I understand you don't see things like other people do.


    Please don't come with your football analogies, they literally mean nothing to me. Try explaining it using terms that make sense to people who couldn't give a single f*ck about football, because you just seem to have a completely unjustified, ignorant position with regards to Brexit, like when you tried telling me at Rockingham how we would have more money for schools and the NHS if we left the EU.


    My sides are still aching at the complete absurdity of your position, it literally has no base in fact, or reason behind it - but humour me, instead of spouting more whataboutist diversionary tactics:


    Why do you want to Brexit?


    What reasoned, clearly explained benefits, either financial, or social do you see?


    Have a go at explaining yourself, just once.
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  34. #1784
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    Quote Originally Posted by Diamond Hell View Post
    more personal insults blah de blah
    It saddens me that you bring such angry rhetoric to the Brexit discussion.

    Actually at the last bike event I tried to kick a bloke off his bike come to think of it. I had stopped to let him past & he smashed off my rear sprocket being an ar$e so I tried to put him off into a tree. Generally the etiquette is to shout or rev up beforehand where the slower bike then pulls over.
    Last edited by Fitz711; 08-07-2019 at 11:22 PM.

  35. #1785
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    Nice diversion.

    And your reason to support Brexit is?
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  36. #1786
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    Quote Originally Posted by Diamond Hell View Post
    Nice diversion.

    And your reason to support Brexit is?
    I support aspects of remain & leave & have no preference other than I want a blue passport as itís my favourite colour, after black.

  37. #1787
    Hope you guys find a way to back out of this mess you have gotten yourselves into
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  38. #1788
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    Quote Originally Posted by bimmer View Post
    Hope you guys find a way to back out of this mess you have gotten yourselves into
    Do you mean this thread, or the Brexit thing?
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  39. #1789
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fitz711 View Post
    I support aspects of remain & leave & have no preference other than I want a blue passport as itís my favourite colour, after black.
    Nice diversion.

    And your reason to support Brexit is?
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  40. #1790
    This thread !!!

  41. #1791
    Quote Originally Posted by Fitz711 View Post
    I support aspects of remain & leave & have no preference other than I want a blue passport as itís my favourite colour, after black.
    I'd be happy to send you one of these, or several if your family need them too - I just need your addess


  42. #1792
    Quote Originally Posted by Neil Mac View Post
    Do you mean this thread, or the Brexit thing?
    Well... both!!!
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  43. #1793
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    Quote Originally Posted by Diamond Hell View Post
    Nice diversion.

    And your reason to support Brexit is?
    Nobody will honestly answer this question and they certainly can't back up the commitment as there are no good reasons to support it
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  44. #1794
    Quote Originally Posted by Ian H View Post
    Nobody will honestly answer this question and they certainly can't back up the commitment as there are no good reasons to support it
    There is one very good reason to support Brexit - You won't have to comply with 5AMLD

    Not an issue for me, as I am the antithesis of a high net worth individual

    https://complyadvantage.com/blog/5ml...ing-directive/

    It doesn't come in to force until January 2020, which is why the 31st Oct 2019 deadline really is Do or Die, Come what May

  45. #1795
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    Quote Originally Posted by UKKid35 View Post
    There is one very good reason to support Brexit - You won't have to comply with 5AMLD

    Not an issue for me, as I am the antithesis of a high net worth individual

    https://complyadvantage.com/blog/5ml...ing-directive/

    It doesn't come in to force until January 2020, which is why the 31st Oct 2019 deadline really is Do or Die, Come what May
    Agreed, hence the use of not being honest about it
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  46. #1796
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian H View Post
    Nobody will honestly answer this question and they certainly can't back up the commitment as there are no good reasons to support it

    Oh no, Iain's a rational person, who is capable of presenting a well reasoned argument - I'm confident, as he's said so himself on a number of occasions.



    I'll bet there's something we've missed, as I'm sure we've barely looked at this subject at all over the last three years.



    I'm sure he's just taking his time typing up his response. He'll be along with an explanation of why he supports Brexit any moment now...
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    I probably like a lot of people have no preference as to what way it goes & donít support either. Iíll come on here & balance an argument for devilment. If I see something unbalanced when Iím looking Iíll throw it in. Hence the having had second referendum comment. However thereís reason on both sides-itís a vision of the way the country will head. Nowt is certain.
    My only other comment is the issue here revolving around democracy. Thatís my concern.

    Anyway thatís where I am & in an hour Iíll be at the golf & again tomorrow.

  48. #1798
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fitz711 View Post
    However thereís reason on both sides-itís a vision of the way the country will head. Nowt is certain.
    And your reason to support Brexit is?

    Unless you're actually just being a dick and genuinely don't care which way it goes, as you've just asserted, in which case, why come and spout utter nonsense you can't back up, 'for balance'?
    It's literally a Diamond shaped Hell at times
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  49. #1799
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    This’ll just go round in circles as that’s your angry rhetoric style but I figure I’m keeping you away from someone else.
    Reasons to support Brexit/ here’s the link https://www.gov.uk/government/news/4...he-brexit-deal

    Now if you want to reply to that it should keep you busy for a while. Put your hand up when you’re finished or go & read a book in the quiet corner. There’s a good boy.

  50. #1800
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    So you're now cheerleading for the deal that's been voted down in parliament three times?

    You really are struggling to provide any demonstration of critical thinking here.

    I could take apart most of those points very easily (which is one of the reasons this tragic 'deal' has been rejected so many times).

    You only see my style as 'angry', because it's challenging the utter boll*cks you're spouting. I'm being very patient with you, as you don't seem capable of answering reasonable questions, much critical thought, or explaining your own personal viewpoint beyond stirring sh*t among those who do hold an actual informed view on the subject.
    It's literally a Diamond shaped Hell at times
    Woodland camping with Forest Schools on the Isle of Wight: campwight.co.uk

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