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View Full Version : Wet Ring Trip - 8-11th Sept



Duncan
11-09-2007, 05:41 PM
day 1
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Our September trip to the Nurburgring started at 5.45 am on saturday morning with the alarm clock going off (not that I could sleep anyway) and getting ready to roll down the road to meet Chris at Birchanger services on the M11 at 6.30 and head to folkestone for the normal eurotunnel over to calais.

The Eurotunnel terminal was heaving and saw several cars in the queues obviously going over to the mecca of cars. 2 Forresters, 1 CRX, an Alfa 75 and a couple of others (all co-incidentally staying at the ringhaus). This built the anticipation of the days to come. Hoping that it would be mostly dry but quietly wanting it to rain so that I could have a go in the wet and see how different it was.

We arrived at the Ringhaus in Nurburg (200metres from the nordschleife entrance) and set to book into the room and unload the car of all the spares, tyres and bags ready for the circuit to open. The roads on the way there had been damp but it was clear (ish) and set for a dry evening (we thought). Ready to go at 5pm we headed down to the circuit to have a coffee before the first lap of the evening. This was going to have to be an easy lap with Chris following us round on a damp track. We did make reasonable progress around the track after the initial rush was through the barriers and were suprised to see cars off already.... this was to truly be the tone of the weekend. The car park was busy with very little space in either of the main car parks at this point.

We went out another 2 times on sat evening before it was eventually shut early because of a rather large accident too close to the official closure time.

I apologise for the lack of pictures of cars but I guess you have all seen cars before and not having the camera handy at appropriate times I decided that it would be easier to leave it in the room and make excuses

Our experiences on track were spoilt somewhat by the car overheating on the way back into the paddock each time and losing lots of water out the top of the expansion tank. I kept filling it up, bleeding the air out but still it did it. Thinking the worst, I changed the map to reduce the boost down to 1.3 bar first of all to see if it helped and would try this out tomorrow on the hopefully dry track.

Dinner at Pinnochios was as usual fantastic value for a wheel sized pizza and beers (cheers for the lift Chris ) with Vamos, Joel to name a few of the many guys were chatting to. Sadly, old age is getting the better of my memory so I am crap with names.

Woken in the middle of the night with rain outside the window. hmmm

day 2
-----------------------------------------

8am track opening for the brave or foolish in the wet of the morning.

It had stopped briefly i think but was still sodden so I decided it was good to go hoping that the wet and reduced boost now would solve my overheating problem so I could at least get some laps in and experience it

I was wrong - thankfully as it turned out later - the overheating still continued. More bleeding of air from my 99% water based coolant system now and more fannying around with the bonnet up at the ringhaus (cant do it in the main carpark ) This time we took more time to bleed it thinking that it would be better.

The car parks and overflow car parks, roads around the area were jammed to the rafters at this point with hugge numbers of cars and people there all anxious to get laps in but worried about the weather or in some cases not worried enough about the weather judging by the amount of new armco the Nurburging Gmbh had received money for by the end of the day.

Another lap - another very hot engine when we came back ... grrr

The day continued along this way until I got fed up and with some detective work we deduced that the thermostat must be stuck closed. I then drained the coolant out of the system and dropped the thermostat out to see it had indeed jammed shut. This was to be solved with the courtesy of a 4mm drill to drill 6 holes in it to make it permanently flow

The car was reassembled at 8.15pm in time for us to run down the the PK for a meal with the rest of the gang and spent most of the evening chatting with Juanjo and Rachel - really great to meet you both After all the work on the car and the relief of knowing that my headgasket hadnt gone I was ready for a session and the beers were going down very well indeed Thank god we were on track in the morning.

day 3
-----------------------------------------

So far I had managed 3 laps on saturday and only 5 during sunday's full day - today must be better.

George and I headed up to the Bergstube to help Juanjo fit the fuel surge kit that he had bought from Zen and got delivered to me to bring over with me. This was fitted in no time at all whilst we chatted and drank coffee to try and get rid of the hangovers from the PK beerathon. Thanks to Martin's hospitality up there

As usual we all amassed in the paddock pre-opening. Simon was there too and wanting to get many laps in having changed discs on his Subaru after cracking one of the new AP discs the day before (whilst taking it easy on the new 6 pots)

The track was pretty dry as it wasnt actually raining but a sighting lap was a definite after the myriad of accident that had occurred the day before.

This revealed two sets of roadworks - one on the straight between flugplatz and SX and the other around the inside and exit off the karussel where 1 of the three smashed Civic Type - R's had been written off.

Another lap and the track was almost dry now so I decided to follow Juanjo out in his bug-eye impreza for a fast lap after filling up with petrol. This was great having someone in the same car to chase - pushing myself to take speed through corners and the resulting exit speed giving us a superb lap with the two sets of roadworks and a lot of traffic of 9.02. I was very pleased about this and was about to go to hotel to change to the Yoko A048's and go out again when the heavens opened - which is how they stayed for the rest of the day

Still, I managed a total of 9 laps on Monday afternoon with 6 in the total wet trying to find the wet lines.

For the evening we decided to head up the the Bergstube (sister hotel of the ringhaus) for a BBQ with Simon, Weeman, Jon_r & co and what a great evening it was. I am glad we went back to a hotel room rather than camping like you lot. I hope it <s>was</s> wasnt very cold.

day 4
-----------------------------------------

Great trip back along a different route as we decided to miss the roadworks in Gerolstein - ended up near Malmedy before hitting the E42 and cruising up through Belgian. Not the quickest route though I dont think.

All in all a trip of firsts...

- first wet lap (actually did 14 wet laps)
- first partially damp track
- first time not braking down the Fuchsröhre (more dry laps were needed to build up from that)
- first time not braking for Ex-Muhle (Karl - this is no way flat &#33;&#33;&#33;)
- first passenger lap in the left hand drive car ... weird
- first time discovering how little grip there is in the wet on the normal racing line (ie none on some corners)
- first time finding a new wet line with lots more grip
- first drive through the River Fuchsröhre
- first bbq at the Bergstube (great idea that )

Bring on the next trip - dry this time though please.

_________________
Duncan

scoobyweb
11-09-2007, 06:09 PM
Great write-up as always Duncan. Cheers for a great first time experience at the Ring (ooh err missus), Can&#39;t wait to go back. Nice to meet the other Guy&#39;s, Simon, Juan and Rachael etc. What a manic weekend for accidents, lots of cars wrote off and a lot of them were uk :o


Chris.

Weeman
11-09-2007, 06:11 PM
Great to meet ya Duncan, that was a cracking night out up on the hill, shat on the PK :lol: Great company, thanks for the laughs :D

It was freezing at the campsite by the way, the size of the fire we lit made some random German, non English speaker come over and warm himself too, the conversation in war film German and broken english was pure comedy.

Back home now, in the warm, those poor buggers have one more night left

ady282
11-09-2007, 09:11 PM
Duncan met you briefly at the petrol satation sat eve but good to meet you mate. We got back to Over about 2am Monday morning&#33;&#33;&#33; Long story but we got home anyway.
Was it a new 07 civic that you mentioned that got smashed if so do you know if it was the 07 plate black one or the private plate black one mate
Ady

Hippychick
11-09-2007, 11:43 PM
Cool report...

I think I took the same route back last time as you via the B roads to Malmedy....managed to find my way round the diversion at Gerolstein this time (thanks Stip :thumb: ) and it was much quicker

Gary Kinghorn
12-09-2007, 06:14 AM
Good stuff Duncan :thumb:

Karl
12-09-2007, 07:07 AM
Am I missing something here, has Nige edited your post and wiped out your whole report, perchance? :blink:

Duncan
12-09-2007, 07:09 AM
Originally posted by ady282@Sep 11 2007, 10:11 PM
Duncan met you briefly at the petrol satation sat eve but good to meet you mate. We got back to Over about 2am Monday morning&#33;&#33;&#33; Long story but we got home anyway.
Was it a new 07 civic that you mentioned that got smashed if so do you know if it was the 07 plate black one or the private plate black one mate
Ady
It was the 07 plated black one :(

Floyd
12-09-2007, 07:10 AM
Yes, very odd. I can&#39;t see the report :unsure:

F

Duncan
12-09-2007, 07:12 AM
Originally posted by Karl@Sep 12 2007, 08:07 AM
Am I missing something here, has Nige edited your post and wiped out your whole report, perchance? :blink:
He has left the important part :D

Floyd
12-09-2007, 07:17 AM
Did you crash?

"- first time not braking for Ex-Muhle (Karl - this is no way flat &#33;&#33;&#33;)"

F

Duncan
12-09-2007, 07:35 AM
Nope - didnt crash, but I was not flat out and lifted aswell.

Simon
12-09-2007, 07:46 AM
Whats going on, did you mention your Cheri Bar incident? :lol: :lol:

Duncan
12-09-2007, 07:51 AM
What is Cheri bar? :D

actually scrap that question, I think I can guess :lol:

vamos
12-09-2007, 07:54 AM
Good to see you there Duncan, the report a bit cryptic?

Did the thermostat solution work for you on the Monday BTW?

Duncan
12-09-2007, 07:57 AM
The full report has been cut down by Nige (dont know why) but yes the overheating was cured and had an extra benefit of oil temperatures of 10C lower aswell :D maximum of 105C on track.

I may leave it that way - saves me £300 ish on an oil cooler :D

Nige
12-09-2007, 08:01 AM
OH FFS. I clicked on EDIT instead of QUOTE :shame: :shame: :shame: :shame: :shame: :shame: :shame: :shame: :shame: :shame: :shame: :shame:

fixed it now....

Weeman
12-09-2007, 08:09 AM
Ex Muhle is now flat, following on from Karls pub advice, I managed one with tom, without the comfort lift, you could here his screaming back at the entrance :lol:

Karl
12-09-2007, 08:24 AM
Never done it myself, well done, Weeman :lol: :lol: :lol:

Duncan
12-09-2007, 08:25 AM
More laps are needed for definite before I can even contemplate that.

For this trip I was planning on getting better around Flugplatz, Foxhole and through the Wipperman to PF section.

http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g281/dynam06/nordschleife/ringtrace1.gif

Getting better - but this was the only really dry lap so didnt have time to push it beyond the comfort area.

p1doc
12-09-2007, 09:41 AM
Originally posted by Nige@Sep 12 2007, 08:01 AM
OH FFS. I clicked on EDIT instead of QUOTE :shame: :shame: :shame: :shame: :shame: :shame: :shame: :shame: :shame: :shame: :shame: :shame:

fixed it now....
pmsl
martin

p1doc
12-09-2007, 09:48 AM
you did better than my wet laps :D
martin

Juanjo
12-09-2007, 01:15 PM
HI Duncan and all,

good to meet you at the ring, despite the weather we had all a good time, I personally went from "very scared" to "fake confidence" on the wet on those two days...
Many accidents and many cars spinning off on the wet tarmac, I think none of us broke the car which is already a good sign, while some bikers had pretty serious accidents... I hope they&#39;re allright.

Thank you with the help with the fuel surge tank, we arrived home around 3am on Mon/Tuesday.

See you next year at the ring, hopefully with a new suspension and a harness...

btw... Ex-Muhle flat??? guys you must be doing the bridge too slow&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33; :D (same goes for the Foxhole... ;)

:thumb:

Juanjo and Rachel

rolty
12-09-2007, 01:39 PM
Nice report Duncan - you still need to post up the pictures you took :lol:

Really good to have some time in the rain, completely changed the track - yet again :rolleyes:

The BBQ was a great idea, let&#39;s just hope that Martin takes our ideas on board for some &#39;special&#39; entertainment at the Burgstube :lol:

Weeman - I don&#39;t envy you for staying in the tent, it was fcuking freezing when we left Nurburg on Tuesday morning :gay:

Dave Malings
12-09-2007, 02:47 PM
Very suspect speeds up Kesselchen........... :whistle: :blink: :unsure:

Floyd
12-09-2007, 02:51 PM
Can we compare these with a Vbox or a Racelogic plot with something like a M3 CSL?

F

Duncan
12-09-2007, 03:30 PM
Originally posted by Dave Malings@Sep 12 2007, 03:47 PM
Very suspect speeds up Kesselchen........... :whistle: :blink: :unsure:
yep - it must have lost the gps signal just before bergwerk - but it was top end of 135 on the clock by the top of the hill so probably 125 + in real life.

Floyd
12-09-2007, 06:26 PM
So what happens if it loses lock with the timing? Does it guess?

F

Juanjo
12-09-2007, 07:27 PM
I&#39;ve got two virtual cup laps from last year, on a dry track, showing Kesselchen speeds of 145 and 146 mph respectively...

I dont know if it&#39;s a signal problem or not, before the weekend Duncan already commented that they were very high... I though I remembered my speedo showing aproximetely that, but since last weekends I have doubts about it.

I&#39;ll ask the Virtual cup guys, and whenever I go again and I&#39;m able to lap on a dry Kesselchen I&#39;ll check out how far/close to reality is it...

See you,

Juanjo

Floyd
12-09-2007, 08:57 PM
Perhaps use a seperate sat nav and compare speeds (fi safe to do so :whistle: )

F

g60racing
12-09-2007, 11:41 PM
Originally posted by dynamix+Sep 12 2007, 07:09 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (dynamix @ Sep 12 2007, 07:09 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-ady282@Sep 11 2007, 10:11 PM
Duncan met you briefly at the petrol satation sat eve but good to meet you mate. We got back to Over about 2am Monday morning&#33;&#33;&#33; Long story but we got home anyway.
Was it a new 07 civic that you mentioned that got smashed if so do you know if it was the 07 plate black one or the private plate black one mate
Ady
It was the 07 plated black one :( [/b][/quote]
Yes it was the black 07 one as I was unlucky enough to be in the back, very heavy smash I&#39;m bloody sore. Thats the last time I get in someone I dont knows car.

Duncan
13-09-2007, 06:28 AM
Originally posted by g60racing+Sep 13 2007, 12:41 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (g60racing @ Sep 13 2007, 12:41 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
Originally posted by dynamix@Sep 12 2007, 07:09 AM
<!--QuoteBegin-ady282@Sep 11 2007, 10:11 PM
Duncan met you briefly at the petrol satation sat eve but good to meet you mate. We got back to Over about 2am Monday morning&#33;&#33;&#33; Long story but we got home anyway.
Was it a new 07 civic that you mentioned that got smashed if so do you know if it was the 07 plate black one or the private plate black one mate
Ady
It was the 07 plated black one :(
Yes it was the black 07 one as I was unlucky enough to be in the back, very heavy smash I&#39;m bloody sore. Thats the last time I get in someone I dont knows car. [/b][/quote]
Ouch ... did you just blag a passenger ride in the paddock then?


Floyd - the lap timing would have the correct timing as that is a constant, it would temporarily lose your position on the world and make one point artificially low as it hasnt picked up a later one, then when it picked up again it has moved on a lot more and assumes that the speed between the two points must have been high.

If you look at mine, juanjos and Nige&#39;s traces this happens mostly at bergwerk due to the trees and cloud. An external antenna might help it.

Floyd
13-09-2007, 08:16 AM
Ouch @ g60racing :( This is an issue that I am thinking more about. I get pax laps with unknown cars and it&#39;s only when you&#39;re into the lap that you may realise that the driver is going too fast for the talent level, or too fast that it makes you uncomfortable. It is possibly luck that I have survived so far without a crash as a passenger...

F

p1doc
13-09-2007, 01:25 PM
if i had you in for pax lap i would crash deliberately :P :affection:
martin

Simon
13-09-2007, 02:30 PM
LOL

Funny how Floyd is loved by all on here :lol: :lol: