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SteveW
01-02-2009, 06:47 AM
I am thinking of rationalising my car "fleet" by getting a daily drive to replace my Fabia vRS & Boxster. It will need to be practical but with the possibility of some Ring fun if my DRT is in bits as usual.

Does anyone have experience with the 1 series. Will it take Ring use without the turbo going AWOL. How is the chassis? What is the difference between the motors?

Darren Langeveld
01-02-2009, 07:01 AM
I've lapped a 120d at the ring, very competent. I've ragged a 123d at Silverstone, and it was very competent.

Both in M Sport trim.

I don't thing you'd find them lacking in much apart from the thrill that a free revving petrol provides. If you know what I mean?

Russ_F
01-02-2009, 07:55 AM
135i M sport do it do it

;)

Stace
01-02-2009, 08:05 AM
Depending on how many miles you do per year, it might be worth looking at one of the petrol ones. They are pretty good on fuel iirc and avoids diesel wrongness. Plus with the difference in diesel/petrol prices now.......

SteveW
01-02-2009, 08:16 AM
Originally posted by Andrew Stacey@Feb 1 2009, 09:05 AM
Depending on how many miles you do per year, it might be worth looking at one of the petrol ones. They are pretty good on fuel iirc and avoids diesel wrongness. Plus with the difference in diesel/petrol prices now.......
I do a lot of miles mainly in Europe so diesel is definitely the sane choice. I can get diesel for about 90p in Denmark but unleaded is over Ģ1 a litre.

The vRS has taught me to like the diesel mid-range torque. Fantastic up Kesselchen.

The down side is that I am on turbo no3 on the vRS. It always blows up on the track.

Simon
01-02-2009, 08:32 AM
I would consider a 120 or 123D for sure. Much to Russes disgust :whistle:

SteveW
01-02-2009, 08:44 AM
Originally posted by Russ_bmworx@Feb 1 2009, 08:55 AM
135i M sport do it do it

;)
Get thee behind me Satan.

Neil Mac
01-02-2009, 07:02 PM
I'd have a 123d in a heartbeat. Same peak torque figure as a new M3, Same peak power figure as an original Sierra Cosworth, and a possible 50+mpg if you're not using the first two numbers.

What you need to refer to is a comparison road/nurburgring test between a 123d and a petrol engined coupe, such as a 350Z.

Hey, what's this on the Driver's Republic website?...

123d Vs 350Z (http://viewer.zmags.com/showmag.php?mid=ghqts&preview=1&_x=1#/page2/)

Dave B
01-02-2009, 07:26 PM
Until last November, I had a 120d with the earlier 163 bhp engine, i had a chip that took it over 200bhp. I got 45 plus mpg overall, 50 on a run and about 23-24 ragging it round the ring. It had standard soft suspension but went well on track. I had changes planned which mainly meant an AC Schnitzer suspension set up for around Ģ700 fitted. My overall plan was to turn it into my track car in 2 or 3 years when its value dropped (but got such a good deal on the Forester....) and as long as you aren't fussed about the howl of a 4 cylinder v-tech or a growly 6 of the 130/135 you will find it superb.
Very linear power delivery and the balance is/was classic 50/50 BMW.
Get one mate, you will not be disapointed

Ed_
01-02-2009, 08:03 PM
Thorleif had a 120d as a company car.

I think he said it was "perfect".

Ed_
01-02-2009, 08:04 PM
Steve,

I would look more to the 3ers. I think they are far better balanced, and look a hell of a lot better as well.

Simon
01-02-2009, 08:35 PM
Originally posted by Ed_@Feb 1 2009, 09:03 PM
Thorleif had a 120d as a company car.

I think he said it was "perfect".
More like he said that it was (Oops I said the F word)ing perfect :lol:

Darran
01-02-2009, 08:43 PM
I really like the look of the 1 series coupé. :shame: Much better than the 3er which looks too long.

Tom
01-02-2009, 08:52 PM
Originally posted by Dave Boulder@Feb 1 2009, 08:26 PM
Until last November, I had a 120d with the earlier 163 bhp engine, i had a chip that took it over 200bhp.
I can still remember cadwell Dave... For being standard and an oil burner, it was epic!

GVK
01-02-2009, 08:57 PM
1 series look like scooby doo's head but drive really well. :veryhappy:

Russ_F
01-02-2009, 08:59 PM
I agree with Dave, get which ever is fit for you purpose(cough 130i M cough)ahem.. and you will love it, ditch the runflat tyres though they are kin orrible

I :wub: my 1

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x247/36M3RUSS/1302.jpg

:thumb:

SteveW
02-02-2009, 05:55 AM
Originally posted by Dave Boulder@Feb 1 2009, 08:26 PM
Until last November, I had a 120d with the earlier 163 bhp engine, i had a chip that took it over 200bhp.
What kind of reliability did you get from the turbo with the re-map?

My vRS was great on the road but did turbos in about 50-80 laps at the NS.

Pedro
02-02-2009, 08:36 AM
Originally posted by SteveW@Feb 2 2009, 07:55 AM
What kind of reliability did you get from the turbo with the re-map?

My vRS was great on the road but did turbos in about 50-80 laps at the NS.
But your Skoda was re-programmed, wasnīt it?

Maybe it was poorly done, or stressed too hard? Iīve never understood the logic behind using a re-mapped diesel engine on track, seems like too much of a risk to me.

Dave B
02-02-2009, 08:39 AM
20k..not a hiccup. Two back to back trackdays in the UK, Did maybe 20 plus laps of the ring and tried a bit too.
I had a tuning box by a company from Austria that cost a bit more but that did not ramp up the common rail pressure but linked in with the fly by wire throttle and squirted more fuel in and something else technical.
On the advice of a mate, Chris Rossiter...UK importer or AC Schnitzer....I trust him and it was well worth the money. It flew!
Oh and I ran 18" wheels with standard tyres, run flats were awful as Russ says
If you do get one,,,i know where there are some cheap but brand new uprated EBC brake discs and red stuff pads :thumb: that I was going to fit. The brakes are OK but these would have transformed the car....

Stace
02-02-2009, 08:40 AM
You'll probably think I'm a :jerk: for asking this, but did you let it tickover for a while after parking up? I used to be an aftersales manager at a Skoda dealer and the technical guy for our area reckoned they hadn't had a failure on a turbo that wasn't the result of hot stops. But then he would say that :rolleyes:

c_w
02-02-2009, 08:41 AM
Something wrong if the turbo "blows up" IMO, but then I've read of so many newer BMW (and now Skoda!) TDs going through turbos as though it's almost a service item. It should last the lifetime of the car or at least 100k. Warm up and cool down periods are probably critical to it's lifespan though.

Pedro
02-02-2009, 08:47 AM
As far as I see it, s simple re-map will do no more than increase fuel at high rpms, if so the turbo, because of exhaust fumes, will run a lot hotter than it was ever going to with the standard setting, if youīre going to run it at full tilt with a re-map, Iīd say itīs obvious itīs not going to last long.

I used my old 115hp Golf on track, as well as my brotherīs 100hp Astra, the Astra has done quite a few laps on warm weather, with the aircon on and four people inside, after each lap it was driven gently for a couple of miles to cool things down, no problem from each. The reason I resisted temptation to re-map either was because theyīd be used hard.

SteveW
02-02-2009, 09:56 AM
Originally posted by Andrew Stacey@Feb 2 2009, 09:40 AM
You'll probably think I'm a :jerk: for asking this, but did you let it tickover for a while after parking up? I used to be an aftersales manager at a Skoda dealer and the technical guy for our area reckoned they hadn't had a failure on a turbo that wasn't the result of hot stops. But then he would say that :rolleyes:
Did I let it idle when I came off the NS? Usually for about 20mins as I waited in the queue to get into the carpark :whistle:

On the rare occasions when I got straight off I used to do a tour of the industrial estate to cool it. Still blew up.

SteveW
02-02-2009, 10:01 AM
Originally posted by Pedro@Feb 2 2009, 09:36 AM


Maybe it was poorly done, or stressed too hard? Iīve never understood the logic behind using a re-mapped diesel engine on track, seems like too much of a risk to me.
An expensive map from the biggest name in diesel remaps. Why do it? An extra 50 ps which is a bargain in tuning terms. Why did it blow up? The KKK turbo is apparently a bit marginal. The more expensive Garrett does OK which is why that is what VAG fit to the higher power models.

Pedro
02-02-2009, 10:02 AM
Then again, that cheaper turbo would probably be ok with itīs original power?

Why didnīt you fit the expensive one after the first one blew up?

jf_cole
02-02-2009, 10:07 AM
Why not throw on an oil cooler to keep the oil temps down going to the turbo or a bigger intercooler, again to keep temps lower going through the turbo?

Im sure those two would help the lifespan of a Turbo.

Drove a 118D in Spain and it was plenty powerful, I reckon a 120d would be enough.

SteveW
02-02-2009, 10:10 AM
Originally posted by Pedro@Feb 2 2009, 11:02 AM
Then again, that cheaper turbo would probably be ok with itīs original power?

Why didnīt you fit the expensive one after the first one blew up?
The first one was fitted by VAG under warranty so no choice.

The second time around Arno did it in Adenau & after waiting 6 weeks for a rebuilt hybrid which never appeared I finally had to go for an original just to get the car back on the road.

I was using my DRT Clio to commute to Denmark & my body couldn't take another track suspended, group N engine mounted, 5 point harnessed, bucket seated torture session :( I thought I had a lump in my throat but then realised that was my bollox.

Pedro
02-02-2009, 10:22 AM
Originally posted by SteveW@Feb 2 2009, 12:10 PM

The second time around Arno did it in Adenau & after waiting 6 weeks for a rebuilt hybrid which never appeared I finally had to go for an original just to get the car back on the road.
Another victim, I can understand your pain

Dave B
02-02-2009, 11:34 AM
I did my apprenticeship at a Turbocharger manufacturer and watched them testing them to destruction. Lack of oil being the biggy...so a cool down and turbine slow down period is vital...but by the time you have slowed from Gantry to car park. I would say that is sufficient.
If you want to chip a nearly new BM, go for the AC Schnitzer chip...much more expensive BUT they take on the full warranty for the engine so your turbo will be covered...worth it if you have a new or up to 18mth old car IMHO...
Or you may be happy with 177hp and 140mph plus sub 8 0-60...and good in gear roll on times..
But I did like my 120d :thumb:

GVK
02-02-2009, 11:41 AM
When I lived in Lincs, a mate had a remapped by Rossiters E46 330d... went very very well.

findlay
02-02-2009, 12:16 PM
http://www.sniffpetrol.com/wp-content/uploads/spadbmw1coupe.jpg

:D

I like the 1-series hatch, not so convinced with the Coop or the cab though...

Russ_F
02-02-2009, 12:54 PM
If it needs to be a wretched oil burner the 123d is the pick of the bunch ;)

rossm
02-02-2009, 01:16 PM
Originally posted by Simon+Feb 1 2009, 10:35 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Simon @ Feb 1 2009, 10:35 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Ed_@Feb 1 2009, 09:03 PM
Thorleif had a 120d as a company car.

I think he said it was "perfect".
More like he said that it was (Oops I said the F word)ing perfect :lol: [/b][/quote]
You haven&#39;t used the F word nearly enough :lol:

rossm
02-02-2009, 02:42 PM
what about the 130D?

SteveW
02-02-2009, 02:52 PM
Originally posted by rossm@Feb 2 2009, 03:42 PM
what about the 130D?
http://www.seaquestmarine.com/Red_Sea_Max_..._p/rsm_130d.htm (http://www.seaquestmarine.com/Red_Sea_Max_130D_Complete_Aquarium_Kit_Black_p/rsm_130d.htm)



??????????????????????????????????????

rossm
02-02-2009, 06:10 PM
Originally posted by SteveW@Feb 2 2009, 04:52 PM
http://www.seaquestmarine.com/Red_Sea_Max_..._p/rsm_130d.htm (http://www.seaquestmarine.com/Red_Sea_Max_130D_Complete_Aquarium_Kit_Black_p/rsm_130d.htm)



??????????????????????????????????????
Do you want a beating?

Gary Kinghorn
02-02-2009, 07:13 PM
Originally posted by Russ_bmworx@Feb 1 2009, 08:55 AM
135i M sport do it do it

;)
You rate yours don&#39;t you

pye21
02-02-2009, 07:15 PM
Originally posted by Dave Boulder@Feb 2 2009, 12:34 PM
I did my apprenticeship at a Turbocharger manufacturer
Holset Dave?

I worked there for a few years after Uni&#33;&#33;

Simon
02-02-2009, 08:03 PM
Originally posted by Gary Kinghorn+Feb 2 2009, 08:13 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Gary Kinghorn @ Feb 2 2009, 08:13 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Russ_bmworx@Feb 1 2009, 08:55 AM
135i M sport do it do it

;)
You rate yours don&#39;t you [/b][/quote]
His is only the 130. Goes bloody well though :o

Floyd
02-02-2009, 08:49 PM
Originally posted by Ethro@Feb 1 2009, 09:52 PM
I can still remember cadwell Dave... For being standard and an oil burner, it was epic&#33;
Agree. It went well.

tertius
02-02-2009, 09:01 PM
Rent-racecar have a 120i which I&#39;ve rented for four days - I thought it was great, beautifully balanced, easy to drive, reasonably quick.

However, the diesels are a fair bit heavier I think. I&#39;d want to drive one before committing to it.

Russ_F
02-02-2009, 09:08 PM
Originally posted by Simon+Feb 2 2009, 09:03 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Simon @ Feb 2 2009, 09:03 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
Originally posted by Gary Kinghorn@Feb 2 2009, 08:13 PM
<!--QuoteBegin-Russ_bmworx@Feb 1 2009, 08:55 AM
135i M sport* do it do it

;)
You rate yours don&#39;t you
His is only the 130. Goes bloody well though :o [/b][/quote]
The only reason mine is a 130i is that they don&#39;t do a 135i hatchback :thumb:

Being 265 hp who needs twin turbo&#39;s (me me me) :whistle:

Dave B
03-02-2009, 10:40 AM
Yes, Holsets...1982 to 1985...maybe a bit before you were there... :whistle:

pye21
03-02-2009, 11:49 AM
Originally posted by Dave Boulder@Feb 3 2009, 11:40 AM
Yes, Holsets...1982 to 1985...maybe a bit before you were there... :whistle:
Yes&#33;&#33;&#33; I did 03-04 and 05-06

Andrew
03-02-2009, 11:59 AM
A colleague at work has a 2008 120d [177hp] M-Sport.

It was very hard for him to get out of his E46 330d Sport [184hp + DMS, Miltek &green filter] and into the 120. He found it &#39;twitchy&#39; when you press on along the Derbyshire lane&#39;s and the midrange is half that of the 330.

So he set about changing a few bits, and added a bilstein suspension kit and front strut brace, and ditched the run flats for 225/45/18 Eagle F1 asymmetric all round.

It is now perfect, sat solid as a rock and out handles the previous standard 330. Thanks to increased exit speeds he manages to overcome the lack of midrange punch :whistle:

MPG is around 37 - only 4 more than the 330d. :(